Thread:JackiBackiBoy/@comment-2008429-20181107172628

'''I'm deciding to bring this up to you because I can see this becoming an issue now that Red Dead Redemption II has been released and I've already gotten into a minor edit war with somebody about this. And me being on wiki for almost ten years now, I know people are likely going to keep arguing about this. Unless some administrative action is taken to deter it. I’m hoping you can put to bed this issue. Which I’ll explain below.'''

You might be aware that for a long time, on the Marston daughter page that essentially the only two details about her were this.

'''1. Javier Escuella knew her, having indirectly mentioned her in the first game. Meaning she was at the very least alive when John Marston was in the Van der Linde gang.'''

'''2. John Marston mentioned a gap of years between his time in the gang and his daughter's death. Originally this gave a timeframe of her death having taken place between 1908-1911. Because it was originally assumed that John left the gang in 1906. And John Marston's daughter was dead by the time Red Dead Redemption take place. Which is in 1911.'''

'''So this information was reliable and was not able to be contradicted for years, until the release of Red Dead Redemption II which totally contradicts nearly everything that was said about John's daughter in the first game. Red Dead Redemption II takes place in both 1899 and 1907. Years she should have been alive in. Yet she is neither mentioned or seen in the entire game. It's as if Rockstar totally forgot John had a daughter. Not to mention that Javier Escuella knew of her yet she is obviously nowhere to be seen in the game.'''

'''Because of this. I elected to change the information and references on her page to the following two sentences.'''

'''"Nothing is known about her, though dialog in Red Dead Redemption asserted that she was still alive when John was in the Van der Linde gang." This is something we know for a fact that the first game implicated. Because Javier Escuella knew that John Marston had a daughter. And because John and Javier haven't met since their time in the gang. This is irrefutable evidence that she was alive and that this statement is true.'''

'''The next sentence is the following "Then died years after John's time in the gang." This is backed up in the first game when John openly states that a timespan of "years" happened in between him leaving the gang and his daughter passing away when speaking to Bonnie Macfarlane.'''

'''Next I made a note that the daughter is neither seen or mentioned in Red Dead Redemption II. Her absence is notable and should at least be mentioned since it seemingly causes some contradiction in what the first game implied.'''

'''Now, the editor i'm having this dispute with seems intent on speculating about the years she died in. By adding the following sources to what I wrote.'''

"Originally, it was speculated that John Marston left the Van der Linde gang in the year 1906. This was later corrected by the story told in Red Dead Redemption II. Red Dead Redemption II depicts this happening in the year 1899 through the mission "Red Dead Redemption". John Marston's daughter is also neither seen or mentioned in Red Dead Redemption II."

'''Obviously this statement has a lot of problems with it. The first being that the original speculative date of 1906, no longer has any relevance to the article because clearly, RDR 2 depicts John leaving the gang in 1899. This citation is referencing the fact that the older version of the article used the date of 1906 to try and date when John Marston's daughter died. This doesn't belong here anymore. Red Dead Redemption II totally contradicts the 1906 date. This information does not need to be referenced anymore.'''

The next reference the editor changed was the following.

'''"In Women and Cattle, John says "I had a daughter but she died. Years before that I rode in a gang." This narrows down the timeline of her death even more, as it is known that John left the gang in 1899. Using this information, she had to have passed away sometime in the years of 1899-1911 for John's statement to be correct."'''

'''This doesn't make any sense. Red Dead Redemption II takes place in 1899 and 1907. A timespan of eight years passes in total and in those eight years, John Marston's daughter is never seen or referenced. Because of Red Dead Redemption II's release, this doesn't "narrow down" anything anymore. If anything, it makes things far more convoluted. We play John Marston's backstory in the new game and it clearly creates a big discrepancy with this assertion. Also if "years" passed between John's time in the gang and her death. How could she have died in 1899? That's just an outright factual error.'''

'''Because all of these inferred details have become unclear. My version of the article no longer mentions any years. Because the years she lived or died are never given in the game, only vaguely inferred. At the end of the day, what we know as a bare bones fact. Is that the first game implied she was alive during John’s time in the gang and then died years after. That’s it. We know nothing about the actual dates and RDR 2 contradicts any timeline people are going to try and come up with.'''

'''In conclusion, I don't think the article should reference proposed dates for when she lived or died anymore. Because this is specualtion. Fan speculation and not actual information the games are giving us. I apologize that this is so long winded. But I wanted to lay all the details out for my case on what is the best way to handle this article so we can take care of this and close off any future debate people might have about it. '''  