I can understand the desire to simplify my edits on this page. However, there are other issues and even inaccuracies now. The Hatfield-McCoy feud was three decades long, not two. The McCoy family was actually not wealthy but were more lower class. And that particular feud was not even particularly Southern, and certainly not Western. There are other famous feuds more associated with the region that the game’s feud is clearly based on. Unless there’s a direct source indicating RockStar’s reference to it, I’d advise against leaving the article to state or imply that the Hatfield-McCoy feud is the only one that the Braithwaite-Gray feud is based on.
I noticed recently that you removed a tidbit of trivia I had on Hosea's article and felt I should clarify it a bit. The newspaper clipping you were referring to was the one next to Arthur's bed, if I'm thinking right? I found one that told of a job he and Dutch did in Ohio. Specifically, you can find it in Hosea's room at the Shady Belle safe house. I would have noted where it could be found when I first added it, but I didn't know if you could find it in the other hideouts or not. I've searched high and low in my second playthrough and it seems that is the only place it spawns. I added it back to the article and noted where it could be found :)
No worries man. Hope I didn't come across like I was griping or getting on you or anything, I just wanted to share the info with you since I could tell you were big into history of the gang from your other edits :) We should definitely add that into his and Dutch's bios. Next time I play my game I'll pull the clipping up and add it so I can be sure to accurately record the info.
Agreed, that's the most likely date. I only say 1876 or "mid 1870s" as a "margin of error" type of thing, since the job (specifically a jail break, if I recall right) happened in February of 77.
By the way, do you know how they found out about Micah's birth year? I haven't been able to find anything that says it's 1860. I'm not doubting it, just would love to see the source with my own eyes, just like I had to see the letter from his brother after hearing of it :)
There’s a newspaper article you can find at his camp outside strawberry that says he was 17 in 1877, so 1877-17 = 1860. Also I’m pretty sure Arthur says Lenny joined in the last six months also. Where can you find the letter from his brother?
Ah, good eye! I've seen that newspaper clipping but didn't seen that it was dated 1877 :)
Yeah, Lenny is definitely a very recent recruit. I can't remember hearing that he joined in the last six months but it was a very recent thing for sure. I recall a conversation where he said before joining the gang he had been on the run for "a few years" since killing the men who killed his father, and since he was fifteen when that happened and is 19 when the game starts (or at least that's what I've read, and anyways Arthur says he's not 21 yet so his age is 18-20 at least), I figure he has to be a very recent addition. I figure he came along not long before or around the same time Charles did, which I also figure was a little bit before Micah and Jenny, maybe a couple of months.
The letter from Micah's brother can be found at Shady Belle. You know the little cabin where you can get a mission from Strauss at one point? It's laying on a crate just in front of that place. Very neat read, gives you a pretty good idea of how those two got along. Gotta be one of my favorite camp mementos :)
I’ll try and find it, on my 2nd playthrough and I’m at Clemens point right now. I think I’m gonna try and finish up the background section of the Van der Linder gang tonight when I get home. Hope you don’t mind but I might rearrange what you added, because Arthur’s journal says Micah and Jenny joined before they got to Western Elizabeth. After that I’m moving on to fill out the rest of the info for the other chapters. This is the page I’m the most dedicated to really
No worries, I was adding that one from memory and was kinda worried it was inaccurate, and the wording of it as well.
You're doing a great job with the page, by the way :) Hey, let me know if you find anything in the game concerning Annabelle, Davey, Mac and Jenny, if you don't mind. I'm really interested in if there's anymore info/conversations about them. They don't really appear in the story (except for five seconds in Davey's case, and a drawing in Jenny's), so all we can do is infer a lot of stuff about them from what others have said, which makes them really interesting to me. The whole dang cast is really great though, especially with the various camp interactions you can see.
Hey, one more thing I'd like your take on. Do you think Jenny took part in the Blackwater heist or was just injured on the way out? I know she got hurt while the gang was escaping, but when I first played the game, my initial thoughts were that an eight member crew robbed the bank: Dutch, Micah, Davey, Mac, Sean, John, Javier and Jenny. But then I noticed that Bill shouts "This is worse than Blackwater!" when being attacked in "Banking, The Old American Art," which makes me think he was present as well. For some reason, I've gone back and forth on if she took part or if she was just wounded as the gang made their escape. What are your thoughts about that, and who all was involved?
Oh cool! Thanks for the Lenny reference thing. I've played that companion activity but never picked up on that :) Dang, seems like they got a lot of members six months ago, huh?
Anyways, any idea who all took part in Blackwater? I've been trying to figure it out awhile now, searching around for references but I've come up with nothing I didn't already know. The game is still pretty fresh though so not all the info is readily available online, just thought I'd ask someone who has played the game and taken in the various facts pretty well :)
Strauss is in his fifties (52-53, to be exact) and Hosea probably isn't much older. Uncle is at least fifty, if his "Between the fall of 49 and the fall of Rome" joke is to be believed. They seem a lot older though, Hosea and Strauss due to their medical issues and Uncle due to his rampant drinking. In addition to how rough those times were anyways, of course.
ProudToBePizza wrote: Incorrect, actually. The original members (past 20 years) are Arthur, Hosea, Susan, and Dutch. We dont know when Uncle and Strauss joined, but it is most likely a few years later.
I was referring to there age not when they joined the gang.
There's this thing called "putting two and two together". Hosea is talking about his faith in Dutch's virtues and how it shattered during "Blackwater", which is slang for the Blackwater ferry heist, which has been constantly referenced in both games as the time Dutch snapped and killed an innocent. So obviously, Dutch killing Heidi was the final straw for Hosea. Yes, he immediately contradicts himself by saying it was dead long before that, but he mentioned Blackwater for a REASON. He's saying he was in denial for the longest time, but Dutch killing Heidi forced him to accept to truth.